C-PRINT^® PRODUCT INFORMATION Rochester Institute of Technology
National Technical Institute for the Deaf
Division of College Advancement
C-Print Development & Training Office
52 Lomb Memorial Drive
Rochester, New York 14623-5604
585-475-7557 Voice or TTY
585-475-5949 Fax

C-Print^® Captionist Online Training
The online training is a distance education program that provides the core preparation for a C-Print captionist to provide speech-to-text services, primarily in a classroom setting. The training incorporates a variety of topics that are essential for promoting success, not only in the captionist but also in the client receiving services. The skill-building portion of the program includes training in a newly modified C-Print abbreviation system, condensing strategies, preparing real-time text and notes, and in using voice to input text.

Cost: $250 academic price; $400 list price

Prerequisite: Purchase of, or access to the C-Print Pro™ Server software. If software is needed, it may be purchased in combination with an order for online training. If you have an existing software license, a username and registration number is required on the order form for online training.

System Requirements: Internet connection (28.8 Kbps modem+, or DSL or cable connectivity)

Registration: Place an order for online training (and software) using the Product Order Form. Upon receipt of full payment, username and password for access to training will be provided.

Participant Skill Recommendations:
1. Typing speed of at least 60 words per minute
2. Awareness of phonetics
3. Excellent listening and English skills
4. Ability to process (understand and restate) spoken information
5. Experience with computers and word processing applications
(If you are interested in obtaining an assessment to help evaluate a candidate's skills, please contact us.)

Completion Requirements:
1. Successfully complete all training modules. Participants must achieve a passing grade of 80% or above on module quizzes before access is granted to subsequent modules.
2. Submit all requisite offline practice materials.

Expiration: Access to the online training will expire one year from registration date.

C-Print Pro Software
The C-Print Pro software is used by C-Print captionists to assist in providing access to spoken information in real-time. Available features of the software include use of the C-Print abbreviation system or automatic speech recognition to input text, choice of individual screen preferences, networking capabilities (TCP/IP), two-way communication, and notetaking tools.

There are two applications available, the Server and the Client.
• Server: used by captionists to provide speech-to-text services. See below for information on the different editions.
• Client: used by students or persons accessing text via a second computer. User will have access to notetaking tools.
 

The software is available in single, multiple, and site licenses.

Regarding C-Print Pro with Voice:
• Users of Standard Edition are eligible to purchase the voice upgrade (see Product Order Form).
• Dictation masks are available for purchase from Martel Electronics (product name – mini mask with 1/8 plug). Visit www.martelelectronics.com.

Important: To purchase the C-Print Pro software you must have a trained captionist who will be using the software to provide services, or you must be registered for the online captionist training.

The C-Print system involves a hearing captionist (transcriber) typing the words of the teacher and other students as they are being spoken.  The system provides a real-time text display that the deaf and hard of hearing student can read on a second laptop computer or monitor to understand what is happening in the classroom.  In addition, the text file is stored on the computer and can be edited, printed and distributed to students, tutors and instructors after class.  C-Print provides a transcript that includes as much of the teacher's and students discourse as possible rather than a word-for-word transcription.

The C-Print system may be contrasted to other forms of computer assisted notetaking and to steno systems.  C-Print is a form of speech-to-text system that employs a standard keyboard.  With a steno system, a trained stenographer using a stenotype machine keys in a special code, which is then converted into English by computer.  Training for stenographers generally requires at least two years and the equipment is relatively expensive and complicated.  The National Technical Institution for the Deaf (NTID) began exploring alternatives to a stenographic system several years ago, and the C-Print system is viewed as a good compromise between word-for-word transcription system and computerized notetaking.

The cost of using C-Print will vary, depending upon (a) what equipment's used (b) the pay level and hours the captionist works (c) the work demands for the captionist, (d) the service arrangements, and (e) funding opportunities.

As is true of any support service, C-Piint is not a solution for all deaf students.  There is no one profile that perfectly defines the student for whom C-Print will be appropriate.  Outlined here are general guidelines (criteria) to help make the decision as to whether a student is potentially a good candidate for the service.

*Student's whose reading level allows for reading the text of the lesson. (At least a 4th grade reading level is a general rule of thumb.)

*Students who typically speak for themselves, not relying on an interpreter to voice for them or have good keyboarding skills. (Students who have good typing skills could actually use the captionist to voice for them by typing their response or comment on the laptop.)

*Students who know little or no sign language.

*Students who have the maturity to work with laptop computers and are able to make use of the notes.  For students who are deaf or hard of hearing and who also have a visual impairment, the font size may be enlarged

*Some students may choose C-Print for some classes, such as those that are primarily lecture and an interpreter for other classes that are primarily discussion.

C-Print seems more useful for situations where communication is primarily flowing from the teacher to the students, it is often useful in other classroom situations such as classroom  lectures and classroom discussions - the captionist will indicate whether a student or the teacher is talking.  C-Print may be more beneficial in some classes than others, for example, it may not be as usefill in a math class.  However, this does not mean that C-Print cannot be used in a math class it, but it may be more challanging for the captionist.

Although the focus of work to date has been with deaf and hard of hearing students, students with other needs may also benefit from C-Print services.  This may require modification of font size and/or notes which are organized to meet the needs of the individual student.  Teachers and administrators have suggested the possible benefit to students with leaming disabilities, attention deficit disorder, dysgraphia and visual impairments.
 
 

The first step in helping a school district or college decide if they should use C-Print is to introduce the C-Print system to key administrators.  The ultimate success of the C-Print service depends greatly on the support given by the administrators who choose to have it in at their institution.  It is important that this group of people see clearly the benefits, as well as the shortcomings of this service.

Recruiting Captionists:
Experience has shown that it is good to recruit captionists locally.  For example, place advertisements for the position in local papers.  The following is a sample captionist advertisement:

Typist/Captionist: part-time opportunity, 18-25 hours per weed, 10 months per year.
Typing speed of 60+ wpm.  Excellent English and listening skills required.
Computer knowledge helpful.

Staff members already employed by the institution such as paraprofessionals, interpreters or office workers may also be selected as C-Print captionists.  A package consisting of three short tests has been developed to help assess applicants and it is recommended that the test package be used to help select any potential C-Print captionists.  The tests consists of a standard typing test, an English comprehension test, and a short phonetic test.  The phonetic test is really a short test to determine if the applicant can "hear" how words are spoken regardless of how they are spelled.  Many applicants who do poorly on this test have a difficult time with the abbreviation rules.

C-Print captionists are often "on display" -- that is, what they type is seen immediately by the student or students, mistakes and all.  A successful captionist must have enough self-confidence to accept that he or she will make mistakes, will sometimes be criticized by the students and will sometimes be placed in awkward situations.  A confident personality is probably as much of a requirement as typing skills.  It is also important for captionists to be able to work without supervision, and demonstrate acceptable/expected professional behavior within a school setting (e.g. friendly but not too friendly with students, dealing with others on an educational team, etc.)
 

Real - Time Captioning
Real-Time Captioning (RTC) is a method for deaf and hard of hearing students to have access to information in the classroom as it is happening.  This access enables students to enjoy participation in classroom discussions, debates and lectures despite their hearing loss.  There are two main forms of RTC:

Steno Captioning - A trained stenographic court reporter types verbatim what is said in the classroom.  Their steno machine is connected to a laptop computer which contains specialized software that converts the steno information into written English.  The student views the laptop computer in order to have real-time access to the information in the classroom as it is occurring.  The student then may receive either a printed or electronic copy of the class transcript for their review.

C-Print Captioning -A trained C-Print captioning types directly onto a laptop computer everything that is being said in the classroom.  C-Print utilizes specialized software developed by the National Technical Institute for the Deaf, that enables the captionist to condense some information into clear and concise sentences.  The captionist uses abbreviations and brief forms that the software recognizes and the student reads from the laptop computer in order to have real-time access to the information in the classroom as it is occurring.  The student then may receive either a printed or electronic copy of the class transcript for their review.
 
 

C-Print, the innovative new technology from the National Technical Institute for the Deaf in Rochester, New York, has made its way to Louisiana.  This technology now enables postsecondary institutions to provide real-time captioning services to their deaf and hard of hearing student population at a reasonable cost.  With C-Print, students are able to have real-time access to information being presented in order than they may effectively participate in class discussions.

The first C-Print training class in Louisiana was held this past summer.  Four individuals were trained and are now working as captionists.  The second C-Print training for Louisiana will be held in December.  We are expecting eight individuals to complete this training and be ready to provide captioning services in January.  The Louisiana State Outreach and Technical Assistance Center is contracting the limited C-Print services to other postsecondary schools in Louisiana as it becomes available.

To further assist in the spread of C-Print, Louisiana State University and the Louisiana Department of Education, both have recently been named as training sites with the National Network Training Grant through the National Technical Institute for the Deaf As sites under this grant, funding will be provided to establish C-Print trainings both at the secondary and postsecondary level for Louisiana.

If you would like more information concerning either C-Print in Louisiana, the National Network Training Grant, or C-Print trainings please contact:

Jennie Bourgeois Pam Francis
Louisiana State Outreach Coordinator C-Print Trainer
Louisiana State University National Technical Institute for the Deaf
I 10 Johnston Hall 52 Lomb Memorial Drive
Baton Rouge, Louisiana Rochester, New York 14623
225/388-4913 (v) / 225/388-2600 (t) 716/475-6019 (v/t)
225/334-2652 (fax) 716/475-5693 (fax)
isbourg@lsu.edu pggncp@rlt.edu

1)The captionist will accurately represent the content of the material presented in the classroom or other captioning situations to the best of his or her ability.  I'@o personal opinions nor advice may be intedected.

2)The captionist Nvill provide services only in settings for which he or she has adequate training and skill.

3) The captionist will keep all assig=ent-related information confidential.

4)The captionist will attempt to facilitate communications between deaf people and hearing people.  When necessary, the form of the language may be modified, but the content of the message must be maintained.

5)The captionist will behave in a professional manner, and abide by the policies and procedures of the agency being served.

6)The captionist will strive to filrther knowledge and skills through participation in workshops or other continuing education situations.

June 1998
 
 

The part-time staff C-Print captionist's primary responsibility is the provision of direct real-time
transcription in the classroom and the rapid provision of the notes to students.  The captionist reports to the individual that coordinates C-Print services.

Specific Responsibilities
A.Provide direct service

1.Provide real-time transcription in classroom.
2.Use consumer feedback, assess effectiveness of interpretation and adjust interpretation accordingly.
3.Assist with culture-specific information and adapt communication to facilitate understanding between hearing and deaf individuals.

B.Communicate with others in support of team goals and the provision of services.

1.Develop rapport with consumers and facilitate resolution of support service concerns.
2.Provide information to faculty, staff and students regarding the real-time speech-to-print service, communication between deaf and hearing people, and support services resources.
3.Represent daily the mission of (your institution) to members of the community through work in the mainstream setting.
4.Attend staff meetings, document service provided weekly, and network with their staff members to maintain the flow of infon-nation critical to quality of service.

C.Demonstrate professional growth.  Areas of growth can include:  upgrading or maintenance of transcription skills
*development of sign language skills
*enhancement of interpersonal communication skills

D.Participate in projects, including committee work and mentoring, as deemed appropriate by coordinator.

Requirements:
*typing speed of 60 words per minute or higher
*knowledge/abilities in phonetics
*excellent English and listening skills
*ability to understand and summarize information while typing
*computer and word processing knowledge
*sign language communication skills preferred or willingness to learn
 
 

General Information

*For courses where C-Print is the only assigned support service, interpreting and notetaking services will not be provided.

*C-Print notes are intended to be used by supported student(s) registered in the course and should not be copied unless otherwise specified.

*C-Print notes are not a substitute for attending class.

*C-Print notes are not guaranteed to have 100% correct grammar or spelling.

Captionist Responsibilities
The C-Print captionist(s) will:

*provide an in-class text display for appropriate support service students.  In addition, notes (generated
from the text display) will be made available to supported students who attend class.

*make every effort to type spoken information word-for-word, and will communicate the information in the manner in which it is intended.  At times (during fast speech), the captionist will need to sununarize information, but s/he will type as much of the important information as possible.

*assist by voicing comments or questions typed by students on the laptop provided, or in a way mutually
agreed upon.

*begin typing upon the arrival of the student(s).  Any announcements made by the teacher before the student(s) arrive will be typed.  After IO minutes, if none of the the supported student(s) are in attendance, the captionist will leave.

*indicate different speakers in the text by using "professor", "female student" and "male student".

*be responsible for facilitating communication between the supported student(s) and others. (i.e. the professor and other students).  This includes asking for clarification from the professor or other students when necessary and sitting in an area accessible and convenient to the student(s).

*be responsible for trying to resolve any problems stemming from student or professor concerns about
C-Print.

*arrive at least 10 minutes before class to allow time for equipment setup.

*be familiar with the scheduled lecture by preparing for class through reviewing the textbook and related
materials.

*find a replacement if s/he is sick.  If a replacement cannot be found, the captionist will notify the
appropriate Support Department who will notify the supported student(s)

*provide on-the-spot trouble shooting for equipment breakdown with minimum disruption to the class.  If no solution is found, the captionist will make every effort to accommodate the supported education student(s) to the best of her/his ability (e.g., take handwritten notes).  Technical breakdowns are unforseen and most often require a diagnosis outside the classroom environment.

Student Responsibilities
The student(s) will:
*introduce themselves to the captionist so s/he is familiar with each student
*be responsible for taking notes and diagrams from the blackboard or overheads.
*be responsible for notifying the office if s/he will not be attending class or has dropped (withdrawn) from the course.  Three consecutive absences will result in the termination of C-Print services. *raise his/her hand when interested in communicating comments or questions through typing on the laptop provided.

The material contained in this handout is used with permission Ms. Pamela G. Giles-Francis viith NTH) 10/2/98
 
 

C-Print is a trademark of the National Technical Institute for the Deaf (NTID)

September 10, 1998

Let me talk a little about the reading responses. 25 people in class, 4 each, that's 100.  I don't want to do all those in the last 3 weeks of class.  Let me talk quickly how I see them function in the class.  This is your area to comment on the readings we are doing in class.  Cicero talks about the need of the order.  With Ken Starr's report, this is a prime example of Cicero's example that's being debated.  You can write about that.  Or what you talk about in class.  If you want to compare and contrast Cicero and Aristotle, that is fine.  Or if you don't understand what Aristotle is saying, go for it.  That's how criticism is built.  Use this as a place for your own reactions.  If we are reading Cicero for Tuesdays, then Thurs someone should bring something in.

 Student: Too late for Aristotle?

 Professor: Only if you are comparing him to someone we are reading.  There is no limit on which day/ but just give me a copy ahead of time, so if I don't know about some of the issues I have time to research it so I'm not caught unaware, but the rest of you are stuck at ground zero <ha>
This isn't a bad thing.  No reason to be afraid of this, Time to explore your thinking about the texts.

Student: I'm concerned about the presentation.  I went to the library and there was very little material.  I e-mailed Univ of AZ and haven't heard from them.  I have only a tiny remembrance of a comment that was made and not sure how to do it. -

Professor: How was literacy developed in the culture that you are doing a project on.  If you are looking at Chinese rhetoric, then look at Confucius.  What about songs, folktale, epic poems.  To have a culture, you had to have someone who was speaking politically.  It will call for all your best research instincts.  Try Winifred Bryant Horner...she is a key rhetorician.  Look for bibliographic essays.  Let me look at my own stuff.  The sources you are looking for might not be in our field.  I know there is a big display on the Indians and it's different texts. type in Persian Empire and see what happens.

 Student: Also try different search engines also, one may bring up something others don't.

 Professor: I want copies of all yours so I can pass it out to everyone.  Should we do it with syllogisms too?

 Bert: Give better deflnitions.

Professor: Let's diagram the notion of rhetoric. 3ust for Aristotle.  Plato doesn't touch syllogism.
Syllogism, enthymeme, maxim, probabilities, signs, topoi, lines of argument.  What else does he throw out?
Example, induction, deduction What is Aristotelian logic?  I think that's what we are trying to get at.

Student: Diagram those topics?

Professor: There's been 2500 years of criticism and I don't think we will get it in 75 minutes.  There is no right and wrong.  There really isn't . They aren't untouchable.  The more we poke and prod at them the better deflnition with have.  SMILE!!  Those of you With knowledge, spread yourself out.  If you aren't one of those people fine one. 15 or 20 minutes?

Student: You mean now?

Student: You said we couldn't do that in 75 minutes, but now only 20? <SMILE>

(Break into groups)

 Professor: Where do we start?  What's a syllogism?  How many kinds are there?

 Student: Cause and effect statement?

 Student: Could it be .... Satan??

 Bert: Based on Fact.

 Student: Series of statements that lead to a conclusion, A maxim will be a conclusion of the syllogism.> You can use maxims to build syllogisms.

 Professor: Turn to page 1112.  This is a guy called Stephen ?? He worked with a woman.  What's her  name, she is never mentioned.  See that picture? ---------- > S
I  Warrent

D= Data
S = Statement

Warrent is the Major premise, what people agree to. Data is minor premise and leads to (S) conclusion.
In Geometry you have a picture and statement.  Your job is to prove that statement.  Using geometric rules, such as Pythagorean theorem.  Stating with the Ist rule to the last the statement will be proven.  That is what a syllogism is.  You walk through the steps, and come to the conclusion that whatever is said is true.

Warrent + Data = Conclusion or Statement.

Student: Data are minor premises?

Professor: Yes.  Minor premises is like everyday information.  "All men is mortal" is grandiose "Socrates is a man" everyday thing.  'Therefore Socrates is mortal".  There are 2 syllogism.  Perfect and imperfect.  Perfect is reserved for science where we know all the warrent and data is true.  But in rhetoric, which is more slippery, it's not as true.  That's the imperfect.  Is it starting to make sense?  Good because it just started to jell for me today about 3 o'clock.
Maxim's aren't built on Syllogisms, syllogisms are built on Maxims.
Maxims are parts of syllogism.
"We hold these truths to be self evident, life, liberty..." that is the essence of a maxim.  A self evident truth.

Student: To me that is a minor premise.  So is it a statement or maxim?  And where does it fall between warrent and statement and data.

Professor: Maxim is a statement without the warrent and data.  We don't need those to know it's true.  To say Aristotle is a member of the rhetorical cannon.  Because I don't have to give evidence.  We accept and agree with that.

Student: The one thing I got is that it is a general fact.

Professor: Right.  ICs a general fact for us.  It is , we don't have to question it.  No one will come to me and say why are you not including Aristotle.

Student: Like an unwritten law.  Like you have to run through crosswalks on campus.

Bert: When the President says, "My fellow American's.." Not everyone can say that.

Professor: I don't know if MFA is a maxim, as much as it is an ethos and pathos move.  That does come into play with maxims.
Enthamemes lead to syllogisms, syllogisms lead to conclusions.  Page 152 toward the top.
Entherneme

Student: Common sense?  If it's something the audience knows you do not have to say it.

Major Premise - Syllogism (Statements of fact that lead to a general conclusion)
Minor Premise - Enthymeme
Conclusion - Maxim

Compare to this class.  We are trained thinkers and we need to use syllogisms.  But with your parents they
might be nonthinkers and you can use Enthymemes.

Student: Maybe we are thinkers in training.  SMILE

Student: So the next time we need to persuade them we need to say, "it's only an enthememe that we want to do what we want to do".

Signs one is specific to general and the other general to specific.

Inductive is Specific to General.
Deductive is General to Specific.

Aristotle taught this in the afternoon in school and it was the equivalent of basket weaving.  The important things were in the morning and the lighter things in the afternoon.  I notice we meet in the afternoon.  Do we have like a conception of Aristotle on what we read.

Student: Will we be tested on this?

Professor: Hmmm.. not I won't do that.

Student: Did he make up the word Enthymeme or were other people use this.

Professor:  The classists would research this and speech communication.  We may be misappropriating words.  The word Kairos.  Are we using it right, where is time from.  The same thing for the word Enthymeme.

It's a good question did he compile everything that was common knowledge, or did he advance these Norwegian theories.  It is one of ht most advanced treatments of Rhetoric.  I was hoping we could get out early today.... Cicero and the Roman matrons for Tuesday.

September 8, 1998

What I've passed out is a description of the presentation so you will have something to hang on to.  This is the first time I've done this.  If nothing else you have something to refer back to.

I've not done this before so I'm wide open.  Whomever you think is important, or interesting or someone who has contributed to this notion of rhetoric.

Rhetoric throws gender in this but Glenn keeps it G7.  Rhetoric is huge and they only present a small part.  This lets you show the rest of it.

The rhetoric or rhetor you study is from 668 BC on.  Progressive that shifts to industrial society.  You can't do a presentation on something that happened in they 1960's.  You can't use the rhetoric of the Indians at "Wounded Knee", but you can focus on the rhetoric of the Iriqoi.  Does this make sense to you guys?

Matt and I had a serious discussion of "the cannon".  You have to define that for yourself and fit the other person or persons into it.

These should be a multi media extravaganza.  Fireworks etc.  Whatever you need, just let me know.  Make it interesting.  Also they presentation should be no less than 25 minutes.  When your group tells me when, you also need to give me a ball park figure.  "We will do it this long, we need -this equipment"...etc

Student: You said we couldn't use the 1960 Indians but what if we picked them back say before the t'new country".

Professor: Sure that is fine.  I mean we have 2500 years.  That should give you enough to work with.  Look for a rhetoric peak, or activity.  If you are looking at a culture that hasn't died you need to pick something where there was a rhetoric peak.

Student: Anything written to turn in?

Professor: No just a group presentation.  It is a group project, and expect all of you to work equally.  After your presentation you will fill out a form to evaluate and discuss your group.  I reserve the right to lower a persons grade based on these evaluations.  Carrolyn you will be happy to know that no one has come up with a definitive answer as to what it is.

Carolyn: Oh good. if I only had Aristotle's stuff to work with..... I'd like for us to draw our outline of Aristotle on the board.

Student: Are you looking for a diagram of Aristotle's rhetoric, or are we saying, this is Aristotle's point.  Which is what we did.

Professor: Let's just put it on the board, and see what you've got.  Need chalk?  We even have they reassuring words "I am a writer".

<Writing on the board>

Professor: Does a syllogism and enthymeme mean the same thing?

Student: A syllogism is deductive reasoning with 2 opposing views.  'An enthymeme is something that as arrived on based on deductive reasoning.
We all read the same book right?  Now what do we do with this.

Student: Back up and punt

Student: Pick some things that are common to all of them.

Professor: That's a good idea.  What is common with all of these.

Student: It all talks about rhetoric.

Student: Maybe a person should take us through

Student: How about someone who didn't try to figure it out.

Professor: Good idea, who did this.  Tell us about it.

Professor: His idea of rhetoric or historical proof.  What is rhetoric for him he describes it twice, but ever the same way.

Student: Rhetoric is when you are dealing with things common to.all people.  One is true knowledge, and the other is probable knowledge.  True is found through experimentation of analysis.  Probably knowledge uses persuasion.  It can't be demonstrated through analysis. for people who can't be taught.  It might be for subjects which can't be taught.  I think he was talking about people that weren't scientists

Student: Could he be talking about people whether were against him

Student: Rhetoric is a mode of inquiry for non-experts.

Student: The faculty for observing in any given case the available means of persuasion.  Does he say anything about persuading people.

Student: No in fact he says the function of rhetoric is to come as near the case of persuasion as each case allows.  He's talking about coming near it, but not about doing it.

Professor: The whole thing is talking about what you need to persuade.

Bert: Book I , pg. 151.  At the end of the paragraph ..."function is part of art".

Professor: Footnote says rhetoric is public speaking.  Dialect is logical discussion.  So rhetoric is separate, distinct.  Not consumed or embedded in anything.

Student: Rhetoric is a mode of inquire for non experts.  What the discover is vihat scientific discovery of dialectic has already established.

Bert: It could mean a "trained" speaker or "tricky" speaker.

Professor: The way we would ask questions about biology versus a Ph.D. in Biology.  He's not talking about someone illiterate, but someone who isn't knowledgeable in that area.

Student:  They may not show all they scientific data, but can use examples.

Bert: I was readying pg. 333, it said "it is a remark that an orator must be skilled in all areas" No one can be a speaker unless he knows every knowledge of .

Professor: Aristotle would say..

Student: No, as long as you have a topoi.  That's his argument against the Sophists, and the "hired gun:.  Anyone who participates in democracy needs to be able ought speak.

Professor: I think he would say I can approach the common man, through the use of the topoi and generate arguments or discussion through that.  It is general applicable to anyone whom I don't have specialized knowledge from.

Student: He would pull in ethics, logic, emotion.  He would know his audience, pick a common topic, and would Parrot back what he heard.  If you know someone's stance you know how to persuade them.  He could get enough generation.

Professor: Very structured.  He set up the way we named plants.  The way we think about the body.  This guy should have been a librarian.

Student: There are things that are common to all human beings.

Professor: We all do it in some way.

Student: I think he said it's part of human nature and everyone wi 11 do it if they have schooling or not.

Student: Doesn't matter where they are from is being able to observe what faculty to use to persuade that audience.

Student: Do you use a wood or 9 iron'.

Professor: So this rhetorical proof, How does it fit in.

Student: The speaker, subject, and hearer who is your audience.  We always have to consider.  Use logic, emotion, or ethics.

Student: 3 ways to affect persuasion.  Pathos, ethos, logic. there are 3 elements of speechmaking...

Professor: Where in the text?

Student: pg. 157 first column.

Professor: So if we look at it that way, the audience is key.

Student: That takes me back to day 1. Who is your audile.  Are you talking up, down or face to face with them.  It depends on who receives it on how good a speaker.

Student: His view is analyze what's available for each audience.

Student: He picks up on the audience..

Student: He doesn't say feedback, he just says observation.

Student:  Page 153) Second column 2nd paragraph.  Rhetoric is.....  <drop down>

Student: Of all the different dialects, rhetoric is as different as dialects.  We don't car what they say back, only what we say to them.

Professor: I think they better is the negative image.  Dialect is black and rhetoric is white.  Rhetoric is to the audience, dialect is the discussion in between.

Student: For a syllogism is you take out what everyone already knows.

Student: But isn't that what a syllogism is, finding a common bond.

Professor: 3 very important terms: (1) Political, (2) Forensic (3) Ceremonial They are key and will be used in rhetoric again and again.

Student: If there's I person who doesn't understand the speaker, who doesn't grasp they message...

Professor: Would Aristotle care.

Student: Yes ... page 155 column 1.

Professor: So Aristotle would be very interested interest the person who didn't understand.  He says that, but based on all the readings you have done   .....

Student: He says if you don't understand they you are wasting my time.  I want to be sure he understands it, but it's wasting my time.

Student: I think it depends on which direction the wind is blowing that day.  That he will go whichever way he says.

Professor: One critic says book 1 was a draft early in his career and should be lopped off.

Professor: How many of you have taught English, or were in a class where you were taught how to argue.

Student: We did book 1, book 2, and book 3. We read through the books and wrote down notes and blocks.

Professor: So it's a diagram of the text as it's written, not what he's saying.